MBHockey
Feb 3, 07:48 PM
Anyone have any suggestions? I hate to have to move the folder out of my home directory and reboot when i need all my CPU for iMovie and iDVD
King Cobra
Sep 4, 06:32 PM
I'm glad I helped someone come back to the forums. I even called you "jefhatfield" for once. Welcome back.
I'll remove that little poetry from my sig immediately, now that you are back.
Now, you mention newbies coming to start flamewars and that's the reason you guys left, apparently. What will this thread cover?
P.S.: john123 was roaming the boards a few days after MWNY.
I'll remove that little poetry from my sig immediately, now that you are back.
Now, you mention newbies coming to start flamewars and that's the reason you guys left, apparently. What will this thread cover?
P.S.: john123 was roaming the boards a few days after MWNY.
madamimadam
Oct 29, 09:02 PM
Originally posted by mytdave
Apple desperately needs to refresh the entire line for MWSF. They are once again becoming the laughing stock of the hardware industry. Everyone else is at 2+ GHz w/400MHz FSBs (yes I do know clock doesn't mean everything, but come on!) using DDR in desktops (up to PC3500 - that's 437.5MHz!) and DDR SODIMMs in laptops, insanely faster graphics cards (GeForce 4Ti's w/1.2GB of DDR RAM on 8x AGP), larger & faster hard drives (100 -200GB on dual ATA 133 buses is standard), dual optical drives (32x CDRWs, etc.), USB 2.0, 54Mbit 802.11, and the biggest slap in Apple's face - insanely superior audio - Dolby Digital 5.1 outputs, SPDIF in & out, plus QUALITY analog. And the PC market does all of this at half the price of a Mac. The thing about the PC stuff is I don't have to run Mickeysoft crap on it anymore, I can run Linux now. I'm in the market for a new Mac, but holy ***** Apple, get your act together! :mad:
Firstly, come back to reality... most of that stuff is on custom built PCs NOT on mainstream models.
To go through all you said individually:
Apple is no more a laughing stock that is was 2 years ago and anyone how laughs at Apple tends to know VERY little about them
Don't be deceived, there is no mainstream processor running at 400 or more MHz. They are quad pumped 100 or 133MHz buses. Sure, this provides more bandwidth than a regular 100 or 133MHz bus but not anywhere near as much as it sounds.
DDR can get as fast as it likes but what good is all that speed when your processor can not work that fast?
I think you are mistaken with the graphics cards... 1.2GB of RAM??? I think not!!! The card would not know what to do with it all. 8x AGP is a joke which is why it is RARELY standard on a brand name machine. Cards can not out clock a 4x port so who needs an 8x???
200GB Hard drives are not standard on brand name machines either because they are too expensive. Neither is ATA 133 because the only thing it is useful for is running HDs of size greater than 136GB. The absolute maxium a drive will perform at is about 55MB/sec if you are lucky so unless you have 2 hard drives running full pelt at the fastest part of the drive there is no difference with having ATA 100 or 133 and even then you are only losing 10MB/s for probably < 5 seconds assuming you could get 2 drives running that fast at the same time.
We can have dual optical drives... what's the problem???
USB 2.0 is not at all nessecary... it is pretty damn useless. Stick to USB 1.1 and Firewire otherwise buy an adaptor/card.
Dolby is your only real good point. You CAN buy Dolby products for Mac (they are RARELY shipped standard with brand PC) but I have not come across a PCI card with X drivers, YET, only USB devices.
Lastly, Apple is NOT expensive... do a comparision yourself but NOT of customer built machines of brand names like Dell. Compare Apples to Apples so to speak.
Apple desperately needs to refresh the entire line for MWSF. They are once again becoming the laughing stock of the hardware industry. Everyone else is at 2+ GHz w/400MHz FSBs (yes I do know clock doesn't mean everything, but come on!) using DDR in desktops (up to PC3500 - that's 437.5MHz!) and DDR SODIMMs in laptops, insanely faster graphics cards (GeForce 4Ti's w/1.2GB of DDR RAM on 8x AGP), larger & faster hard drives (100 -200GB on dual ATA 133 buses is standard), dual optical drives (32x CDRWs, etc.), USB 2.0, 54Mbit 802.11, and the biggest slap in Apple's face - insanely superior audio - Dolby Digital 5.1 outputs, SPDIF in & out, plus QUALITY analog. And the PC market does all of this at half the price of a Mac. The thing about the PC stuff is I don't have to run Mickeysoft crap on it anymore, I can run Linux now. I'm in the market for a new Mac, but holy ***** Apple, get your act together! :mad:
Firstly, come back to reality... most of that stuff is on custom built PCs NOT on mainstream models.
To go through all you said individually:
Apple is no more a laughing stock that is was 2 years ago and anyone how laughs at Apple tends to know VERY little about them
Don't be deceived, there is no mainstream processor running at 400 or more MHz. They are quad pumped 100 or 133MHz buses. Sure, this provides more bandwidth than a regular 100 or 133MHz bus but not anywhere near as much as it sounds.
DDR can get as fast as it likes but what good is all that speed when your processor can not work that fast?
I think you are mistaken with the graphics cards... 1.2GB of RAM??? I think not!!! The card would not know what to do with it all. 8x AGP is a joke which is why it is RARELY standard on a brand name machine. Cards can not out clock a 4x port so who needs an 8x???
200GB Hard drives are not standard on brand name machines either because they are too expensive. Neither is ATA 133 because the only thing it is useful for is running HDs of size greater than 136GB. The absolute maxium a drive will perform at is about 55MB/sec if you are lucky so unless you have 2 hard drives running full pelt at the fastest part of the drive there is no difference with having ATA 100 or 133 and even then you are only losing 10MB/s for probably < 5 seconds assuming you could get 2 drives running that fast at the same time.
We can have dual optical drives... what's the problem???
USB 2.0 is not at all nessecary... it is pretty damn useless. Stick to USB 1.1 and Firewire otherwise buy an adaptor/card.
Dolby is your only real good point. You CAN buy Dolby products for Mac (they are RARELY shipped standard with brand PC) but I have not come across a PCI card with X drivers, YET, only USB devices.
Lastly, Apple is NOT expensive... do a comparision yourself but NOT of customer built machines of brand names like Dell. Compare Apples to Apples so to speak.
jefhatfield
Sep 13, 06:34 PM
truth is pentium 1 is a 5th generation processor
pentium pro thru pentium III is 6th generation
athlon from amd is 7th generation...the first 7th generation chip
and pentium 5 would be considered at least 7th generation and perhaps 8th generation pc processor
but no way can any G4 beat a pentium 5 at over 3 ghz...but then again, but 2nd quarter we may hve the G5 which can beat pentium 4 but maybe not pentium 5, but that is all speculation into the future
who really cares, after 3 ghz, if pc is faster or macs are faster...point is, both will be fast enough for vast majority of users
pentium pro thru pentium III is 6th generation
athlon from amd is 7th generation...the first 7th generation chip
and pentium 5 would be considered at least 7th generation and perhaps 8th generation pc processor
but no way can any G4 beat a pentium 5 at over 3 ghz...but then again, but 2nd quarter we may hve the G5 which can beat pentium 4 but maybe not pentium 5, but that is all speculation into the future
who really cares, after 3 ghz, if pc is faster or macs are faster...point is, both will be fast enough for vast majority of users
gekko513
Apr 3, 11:43 AM
You got 7 right!
You have dabbled in the world of iPods but still rely on your Windows PC
What an insult! :eek:
You have dabbled in the world of iPods but still rely on your Windows PC
What an insult! :eek:
Hemingray
Sep 18, 07:23 PM
Here's a big reason to wait... According to MOSR, Apple is working on new battery technologies for their portable line:
For one, Apple is working on new battery technology for its PowerBooks and iBooks based on new ion-polymer techniques that will nearly double watt-hour capacity compared to existing Lithium Ion batteries.
Secondly, OS X tends to use more battery power than OS9 primarily because it is more disk-intensive. OS X is physically much larger than OS9 in a typcial installation, and includes an exponentially larger number of individual files. In typical usage, OS X must read and write a much larger number of files spread out much further across the disk, and a significantly greater total data rate, than OS9 because of this. As a result, the disk works harder and drains more power.
Apple's marketing doublespeak allows for some margin in interpreting this, because system configurations with large amounts of RAM installed will tend to do better in OS X than in OS9 - RAM drains power, but dramatically less than disk usage does. PBG4s with at least 384MB of RAM (512-768MB is optimal) can cache most system data and greatly reduce these small but numerous disk accesses which cause most of the battery life problems in X.
Apple is working to implement more all-encompassing memory caching to prevent unnecessary disk access not only for battery life savings, but also for greater system performance. Also, new processor power reduction features will be included in Mac OS X 10.3 Panther, due out next year.
The new Macs that will not boot OS9 due out in January are probably desktops; it will be a few more months before Powerbooks experience this problem, and perhaps 6 months-plus for the iBook. By then, Apple's various solutions should be in place, and although battery life may not be optimal under OS X until a post-10.3 release, it should be getting closer with each new decimal release - and new battery hardware due out next year should close the gap sufficiently that Mac users will have nothing to complain about.
Read the full article over at www.macosrumors.com. I will definitely be waiting to buy my iBook for when they increase the battery life.
For one, Apple is working on new battery technology for its PowerBooks and iBooks based on new ion-polymer techniques that will nearly double watt-hour capacity compared to existing Lithium Ion batteries.
Secondly, OS X tends to use more battery power than OS9 primarily because it is more disk-intensive. OS X is physically much larger than OS9 in a typcial installation, and includes an exponentially larger number of individual files. In typical usage, OS X must read and write a much larger number of files spread out much further across the disk, and a significantly greater total data rate, than OS9 because of this. As a result, the disk works harder and drains more power.
Apple's marketing doublespeak allows for some margin in interpreting this, because system configurations with large amounts of RAM installed will tend to do better in OS X than in OS9 - RAM drains power, but dramatically less than disk usage does. PBG4s with at least 384MB of RAM (512-768MB is optimal) can cache most system data and greatly reduce these small but numerous disk accesses which cause most of the battery life problems in X.
Apple is working to implement more all-encompassing memory caching to prevent unnecessary disk access not only for battery life savings, but also for greater system performance. Also, new processor power reduction features will be included in Mac OS X 10.3 Panther, due out next year.
The new Macs that will not boot OS9 due out in January are probably desktops; it will be a few more months before Powerbooks experience this problem, and perhaps 6 months-plus for the iBook. By then, Apple's various solutions should be in place, and although battery life may not be optimal under OS X until a post-10.3 release, it should be getting closer with each new decimal release - and new battery hardware due out next year should close the gap sufficiently that Mac users will have nothing to complain about.
Read the full article over at www.macosrumors.com. I will definitely be waiting to buy my iBook for when they increase the battery life.
MacRumorUser
Mar 21, 11:15 AM
I guess I'm playing a different wow. No nagging guild and I'm well past 20.
Probably so. There has to be a reason why 5 million others are playing :) Just posting my experience which of course will be different to others.
Just found the game wanted tooooo much from me in order to get anything rewarding out.
The solo stuff is hack at a wolf, hack at a more powerful wolf, hack at a ogre, hack at... Sometimes it's just so dang repetitive...but the dungeons and caves are cool...but even then can be annoying...you get stuck with folks who play non stop and have done it 25 times and they spoil every little bit and there's 0% failure chance...takes the fun out....
Yep that was it for me. Solo levelling - run here kill 10 of these, run here kill 20 of these. That gets so repetative and tiresome, you look for a decent mission/quest and find you really need a guild/group to do it... And then exactly as you say "you get stuck with folks who play non stop and have done it 25 times and they spoil every little bit and there's 0% failure chance...takes the fun out...."
Probably so. There has to be a reason why 5 million others are playing :) Just posting my experience which of course will be different to others.
Just found the game wanted tooooo much from me in order to get anything rewarding out.
The solo stuff is hack at a wolf, hack at a more powerful wolf, hack at a ogre, hack at... Sometimes it's just so dang repetitive...but the dungeons and caves are cool...but even then can be annoying...you get stuck with folks who play non stop and have done it 25 times and they spoil every little bit and there's 0% failure chance...takes the fun out....
Yep that was it for me. Solo levelling - run here kill 10 of these, run here kill 20 of these. That gets so repetative and tiresome, you look for a decent mission/quest and find you really need a guild/group to do it... And then exactly as you say "you get stuck with folks who play non stop and have done it 25 times and they spoil every little bit and there's 0% failure chance...takes the fun out...."
Josh
Mar 31, 01:58 PM
Steve Ballmer is a quack; undeniably the biggest fool on the planet.
Well, I take that back. Apparently, someone had children with him...
Well, I take that back. Apparently, someone had children with him...
menziep
Mar 23, 11:44 AM
Are GPUs Supported By SETi or Folding
Dignan
Sep 4, 05:44 PM
I dont get it.
cycocelica
Jun 20, 03:05 PM
works for me
funkywhat2
Sep 6, 08:02 PM
Originally posted by applemacdude
I expect that Apple will release a new PDA in the near future.... Maybe It will be called the.....?
it's never gonna happen so don't even think about it.
and if you want a good apple pda, then i recommend a newton mp 2100.:)
I expect that Apple will release a new PDA in the near future.... Maybe It will be called the.....?
it's never gonna happen so don't even think about it.
and if you want a good apple pda, then i recommend a newton mp 2100.:)
Aniej
Jan 3, 04:51 PM
Looks like I might have gone and found my own answer. here is a link in case anyone else has a similar question. it's Wikipedia, but it is pretty good.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_distributed_computing_projects
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_distributed_computing_projects
LtRammstein
Jun 27, 10:56 AM
I don't understand what this "labor law" thing is all about. The Chinese government has done worse things to it's people than Apple is in the factories. If you ask me, both are in the wrong, but China is still communist, so it really doesn't matter. Everyone is still paid the same.
Steve
Steve
DrStrangelove
May 3, 10:36 AM
You can get as granular with the analysis as you like I suppose.
I prefer to keep it much simpler.
One guy was cool and the other was not. The words they were speaking were for folks that have already made their computing choices. And the words were mostly for Macaphiles. Those ads aren't going to convert anyone.
99.9% of advertising, especially when a visual medium is utilized, is to evoke an emotional response.
The ads aren't designed to convert-- they're designed to reassure us Mac heads that we've made the right choice and we're the cool ones.
Works for me.
I prefer to keep it much simpler.
One guy was cool and the other was not. The words they were speaking were for folks that have already made their computing choices. And the words were mostly for Macaphiles. Those ads aren't going to convert anyone.
99.9% of advertising, especially when a visual medium is utilized, is to evoke an emotional response.
The ads aren't designed to convert-- they're designed to reassure us Mac heads that we've made the right choice and we're the cool ones.
Works for me.
mattscott306
Mar 19, 11:20 AM
I was under the impression that it wasn't possible to use a PB display as an external monitor, unless you were running it over a network or whatnot.
vniow
Sep 15, 12:37 AM
click please (http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=11298)
menziep
Apr 18, 01:32 PM
I think that Google are set to release 4 things in the near future.
1. A Movie Creator - Mostly like iMovie with DVD burning built in.
2. A Basic music Creator - Mostly Like Garageband.
3. A Google web browser - It will have dierct access to all of google's services.
4. A Google Media Player - It will play most formats as well as Videos from Google's Video Download Service. (it will be intergrated with the web Brower)
By The way ilife and mac os x have these apps allready. (see below)
Free Nature Screensaver
1. A Movie Creator - Mostly like iMovie with DVD burning built in.
2. A Basic music Creator - Mostly Like Garageband.
3. A Google web browser - It will have dierct access to all of google's services.
4. A Google Media Player - It will play most formats as well as Videos from Google's Video Download Service. (it will be intergrated with the web Brower)
By The way ilife and mac os x have these apps allready. (see below)
jasonpaul75
Sep 9, 06:26 PM
It saddens me to say it...but should I be abandoning the laser printer that I purchased only a year and a half ago. It's been sooooo long does either Apple or Epson ever plan to support my $400 paperweight?
PO'd in Northern VA....
PO'd in Northern VA....
JeDiBoYTJ
Mar 14, 08:40 AM
all your base are belong to AOL
I read an article yesterday that it only applies to people who signed up for an AOL IM account since Feb 05...
I read an article yesterday that it only applies to people who signed up for an AOL IM account since Feb 05...
JupiterZen
Oct 28, 02:54 AM
Originally posted by arn
actually I don't think it's an old fake... I took a screenshot from a quicktime clip.
arn
Show us the clip, and maybe we'll believe you then ;)
actually I don't think it's an old fake... I took a screenshot from a quicktime clip.
arn
Show us the clip, and maybe we'll believe you then ;)
Dagless
Mar 18, 09:54 AM
Live gave it 5/5, saying that the graphics "look real", they demonstrated this by posting a screenshot of one of the pro female players in all her jagged glory.
RacerX
Jun 25, 02:24 PM
First, lets start out with the obvious... Why would you take either everything2.com or Wikipedia(1) as a better reference than me? If I put the contents of these posts on my site, would that make the information more valid for you than me talking directly to you and answering your questions?(2)
What I'm telling you is mostly from the NeXT community's point of view... the Mac community (specially back in the 1980s) followed Apple's party line on these events.
This book was co-written by the co-founder of MacWorld so I think you could probably say he was �in the community� when the NeXT story was unfolding.When started, MacWorld wasn't completely independent from Apple... in fact it was (to start with) part of Apple marketing for the Macintosh.
Ok, but this article says that the non-compete clause stated all NeXT computers had only (a big only of course but nevertheless) to be more powerful than the similar Apple product so it wouldn�t compete?Originally Posted by everything2.com
When Jobs promptly resigned, Apple sued him for dereliction of duties (hah!)....I don�t quite understand that (there has to be more to it) but it would link with the prices and specs you give above that make each NeXT system more powerful and better specced than anything Apple had.
Well, Jobs had no duties at Apple... and he had free reign of the company to go where he pleased and do as he pleased. And so he went around talking to people about starting up a new computer company.
At this stage the company they were talking about was aimed at the education market and Jobs presented his ideas to the Apple board to get their support... and more importantly, their financial backing. He honestly believed that Apple would help him do this.
The board, when seeing the people Jobs was going to take with him sued.
It was at this point when Next (as it was originally written) abandon the education market as anything more than a jumping off point into other markets. Rather than being an Apple partner, Next was to be a stand alone computer company.
This change (in Apple's eyes) upped the ante in the legal case. It was no longer about taking both key and non-key people from Apple, Next was now going to be a full on competitor with Apple.
This was where the non-compete clause came in. Next could sell in any market other than Apple's core market, the desktop. This really only left open the workstation and server markets. It was the fact that Next was being forced into the workstation market that pushed Unix at them. They needed to be Unix based to compete as workstation class systems.
To think that the addition of Unix was for students is completely illogical. By adding in Unix, Next was adding on an additional $700 in licensing per computer that could have been avoided if Unix wasn't there.
No, Next wasn't designing computers for schools... they were designing workstations to compete with the likes of Sun and Silicon Graphics.
I can�t find anything that says NeXT targeted the education market as a first step...But that was while he was still with Apple and Next was going to be an Apple partner company... not a competitor or a stand alone computer company. Apple's rejection of Jobs and his ideas radically change the directions of what Next was going to be before Next was really fully formed as a company.
Furthermore, according to wikipedia one of the main connotations for the emphasized �e� in NeXT is supposedly �education�.
However, because the NeXT cube was shunned by its core market, it then had to try and break into the workstation market because:Originally Posted by everything2.com
Although the press was in love with the machine, its target market, higher education, saw things differently. Although it came with a full array of programs including Mathematica, a reference library, and the full works of William Shakespeare, it was too expensive and loaded to be a personal computer, yet too underpowered to be a workstation, the computer was dubbed by NeXT marketing to be a "personal workstation.Like I said, unless you think everyone at NeXT was a fool, the system they designed wasn't designed for students. It was designed for mid-range workstation use.
And it is major revisionist history to say that NeXT computers were underpowered. Motorola's 68030 was a workstation class processor at the time, and Silicon Graphics had just previously been using the 68020 as their main processor.
Both Apple and NeXT were using processors that far exceeded anything used in Intel based PCs at that time. Further, NeXT started using the 68040 more than a year before Apple. The 68040 was as fast as the MIPS R3000 processor used in Silicon Graphics systems and the microSPARC used by Sun.
Like I said, the only reason for using Unix was because the system wasn't aimed at students or the desktop. And the inclusion of Mathematica is a perfect example of what it was designed for... high end mathematics (the area I first started using NeXT system in). Also Mathematica wasn't included on systems sold outside the education market. If you wanted Mathematica on a NeXT system and were not a student/educator, you were paying full price. But you were also paying to run Mathematica on the best system for Mathematica.
And how good was Mathematica on NeXT hardware?
Last month after a presentation I gave someone came up to me to ask about NeXT software and hardware. What they wanted it for was to run a copy of Mathematica on (which version 3 can still be purchased for NeXT hardware for $35).(3)
Mathematica isn't software for students... it is professional software for mathematicians. A single user license of Mathematica today is about $1,800, which is more than twice the price of QuarkXPress.
These were designed as professional, workstation class, systems.
On the subject of the change from Next to NeXT, this was done when Paul Rand of Yale designed the NeXT logo. He took his inspiration from Robert Indiana's LOVE painting. Rand's idea for emphasizing the "e" by making it the only lower case letter was to represent education, excellence, expertise, exceptional, excitement and e=mc2. So yeah, education was part of it... but then again, so is Special Relativity and I don't see anyone saying that these computers were designed for just the physics market.
http://www.shawcomputing.net/racerx/love_next.jpg
The LOVE painting and NeXT logo
Is it not necessarily that they got it all wrong and all right, just that the pieces came together better the second time round at Apple and Steve had learnt from his experiences and applied a better ethic?Well, if you discount what I'm saying for what others are saying... then NeXT people were practically morons.
When you add in the factors I'm telling you about, you start to realize that to have made it to 1996 was an amazing task. And the fact that Sun was about to attack the desktop market based on a partnership with NeXT tells you where NeXT was at the time that Apple acquired them. NeXT had given up on operating systems by this point in the same way that they had given up on hardware in 1993. Handing that part of their business over to Sun would at least give people a chance to experience NEXTSTEP... even if it was Solaris underneath rather than Mach/BSD.
But NeXT wasn't about to go under at that point either. NeXT was going to keep the areas that made them money... OpenStep Enterprise (runtime environment for other platforms), Enterprise Objects and WebObjects.
And like I've said many times before, Sun was flush with cash at this point. They were more than willing to buy any company that they saw as being up for sale... and NeXT wasn't up for sale.
:rolleyes:
Well, except for when Jobs offered it to Apple.
Is there any recommended reading on the subject?!I haven't found any good books on NeXT... not that tell the whole story.
Sadly, most skip the points of the settlement, what NeXT was aiming for early on, just how powerful NeXT computers were at the time of there original release (comparable in speed to both the low end Sun and Silicon Graphics workstations), and the direction NeXT was going with Sun before Apple bought them (which seems to be universally ignored by everyone).
All of those were major factors in the history of NeXT. But all those factors contradict the legend of the NeXT's failure... which seems to be the only story worth printing.
(1) Wikipedia is full of errors on the history of NeXT, Rhapsody and Apple. A good example is that Wikipedia has TextEdit as being the replacement for WriteNow on NeXT computers. TextEdit was a demo app included with OPENSTEP and didn't become the default word processor until the release of Rhapsody. From NEXTSTEP 2.1 to OPENSTEP 4.2 the default word processor was Edit.
(2) The reason I'm willing to write all this is that it gives me an excuse to finally write it all down so I can eventually make a page on this for my NeXT site.
(3) I, personally, run Mathematica 2.2.2 on my PowerBook 3400c, PowerBook Duo 2300c and in Blue Box on my PowerMac 8600/300. While nice software, I rarely had use for any computer stuff in my area of mathematics. I do run Geomview on an OPENSTEP system though.
What I'm telling you is mostly from the NeXT community's point of view... the Mac community (specially back in the 1980s) followed Apple's party line on these events.
This book was co-written by the co-founder of MacWorld so I think you could probably say he was �in the community� when the NeXT story was unfolding.When started, MacWorld wasn't completely independent from Apple... in fact it was (to start with) part of Apple marketing for the Macintosh.
Ok, but this article says that the non-compete clause stated all NeXT computers had only (a big only of course but nevertheless) to be more powerful than the similar Apple product so it wouldn�t compete?Originally Posted by everything2.com
When Jobs promptly resigned, Apple sued him for dereliction of duties (hah!)....I don�t quite understand that (there has to be more to it) but it would link with the prices and specs you give above that make each NeXT system more powerful and better specced than anything Apple had.
Well, Jobs had no duties at Apple... and he had free reign of the company to go where he pleased and do as he pleased. And so he went around talking to people about starting up a new computer company.
At this stage the company they were talking about was aimed at the education market and Jobs presented his ideas to the Apple board to get their support... and more importantly, their financial backing. He honestly believed that Apple would help him do this.
The board, when seeing the people Jobs was going to take with him sued.
It was at this point when Next (as it was originally written) abandon the education market as anything more than a jumping off point into other markets. Rather than being an Apple partner, Next was to be a stand alone computer company.
This change (in Apple's eyes) upped the ante in the legal case. It was no longer about taking both key and non-key people from Apple, Next was now going to be a full on competitor with Apple.
This was where the non-compete clause came in. Next could sell in any market other than Apple's core market, the desktop. This really only left open the workstation and server markets. It was the fact that Next was being forced into the workstation market that pushed Unix at them. They needed to be Unix based to compete as workstation class systems.
To think that the addition of Unix was for students is completely illogical. By adding in Unix, Next was adding on an additional $700 in licensing per computer that could have been avoided if Unix wasn't there.
No, Next wasn't designing computers for schools... they were designing workstations to compete with the likes of Sun and Silicon Graphics.
I can�t find anything that says NeXT targeted the education market as a first step...But that was while he was still with Apple and Next was going to be an Apple partner company... not a competitor or a stand alone computer company. Apple's rejection of Jobs and his ideas radically change the directions of what Next was going to be before Next was really fully formed as a company.
Furthermore, according to wikipedia one of the main connotations for the emphasized �e� in NeXT is supposedly �education�.
However, because the NeXT cube was shunned by its core market, it then had to try and break into the workstation market because:Originally Posted by everything2.com
Although the press was in love with the machine, its target market, higher education, saw things differently. Although it came with a full array of programs including Mathematica, a reference library, and the full works of William Shakespeare, it was too expensive and loaded to be a personal computer, yet too underpowered to be a workstation, the computer was dubbed by NeXT marketing to be a "personal workstation.Like I said, unless you think everyone at NeXT was a fool, the system they designed wasn't designed for students. It was designed for mid-range workstation use.
And it is major revisionist history to say that NeXT computers were underpowered. Motorola's 68030 was a workstation class processor at the time, and Silicon Graphics had just previously been using the 68020 as their main processor.
Both Apple and NeXT were using processors that far exceeded anything used in Intel based PCs at that time. Further, NeXT started using the 68040 more than a year before Apple. The 68040 was as fast as the MIPS R3000 processor used in Silicon Graphics systems and the microSPARC used by Sun.
Like I said, the only reason for using Unix was because the system wasn't aimed at students or the desktop. And the inclusion of Mathematica is a perfect example of what it was designed for... high end mathematics (the area I first started using NeXT system in). Also Mathematica wasn't included on systems sold outside the education market. If you wanted Mathematica on a NeXT system and were not a student/educator, you were paying full price. But you were also paying to run Mathematica on the best system for Mathematica.
And how good was Mathematica on NeXT hardware?
Last month after a presentation I gave someone came up to me to ask about NeXT software and hardware. What they wanted it for was to run a copy of Mathematica on (which version 3 can still be purchased for NeXT hardware for $35).(3)
Mathematica isn't software for students... it is professional software for mathematicians. A single user license of Mathematica today is about $1,800, which is more than twice the price of QuarkXPress.
These were designed as professional, workstation class, systems.
On the subject of the change from Next to NeXT, this was done when Paul Rand of Yale designed the NeXT logo. He took his inspiration from Robert Indiana's LOVE painting. Rand's idea for emphasizing the "e" by making it the only lower case letter was to represent education, excellence, expertise, exceptional, excitement and e=mc2. So yeah, education was part of it... but then again, so is Special Relativity and I don't see anyone saying that these computers were designed for just the physics market.
http://www.shawcomputing.net/racerx/love_next.jpg
The LOVE painting and NeXT logo
Is it not necessarily that they got it all wrong and all right, just that the pieces came together better the second time round at Apple and Steve had learnt from his experiences and applied a better ethic?Well, if you discount what I'm saying for what others are saying... then NeXT people were practically morons.
When you add in the factors I'm telling you about, you start to realize that to have made it to 1996 was an amazing task. And the fact that Sun was about to attack the desktop market based on a partnership with NeXT tells you where NeXT was at the time that Apple acquired them. NeXT had given up on operating systems by this point in the same way that they had given up on hardware in 1993. Handing that part of their business over to Sun would at least give people a chance to experience NEXTSTEP... even if it was Solaris underneath rather than Mach/BSD.
But NeXT wasn't about to go under at that point either. NeXT was going to keep the areas that made them money... OpenStep Enterprise (runtime environment for other platforms), Enterprise Objects and WebObjects.
And like I've said many times before, Sun was flush with cash at this point. They were more than willing to buy any company that they saw as being up for sale... and NeXT wasn't up for sale.
:rolleyes:
Well, except for when Jobs offered it to Apple.
Is there any recommended reading on the subject?!I haven't found any good books on NeXT... not that tell the whole story.
Sadly, most skip the points of the settlement, what NeXT was aiming for early on, just how powerful NeXT computers were at the time of there original release (comparable in speed to both the low end Sun and Silicon Graphics workstations), and the direction NeXT was going with Sun before Apple bought them (which seems to be universally ignored by everyone).
All of those were major factors in the history of NeXT. But all those factors contradict the legend of the NeXT's failure... which seems to be the only story worth printing.
(1) Wikipedia is full of errors on the history of NeXT, Rhapsody and Apple. A good example is that Wikipedia has TextEdit as being the replacement for WriteNow on NeXT computers. TextEdit was a demo app included with OPENSTEP and didn't become the default word processor until the release of Rhapsody. From NEXTSTEP 2.1 to OPENSTEP 4.2 the default word processor was Edit.
(2) The reason I'm willing to write all this is that it gives me an excuse to finally write it all down so I can eventually make a page on this for my NeXT site.
(3) I, personally, run Mathematica 2.2.2 on my PowerBook 3400c, PowerBook Duo 2300c and in Blue Box on my PowerMac 8600/300. While nice software, I rarely had use for any computer stuff in my area of mathematics. I do run Geomview on an OPENSTEP system though.
gandalf55
Oct 18, 04:13 PM
the prob with this device is its an aftermarket hardware unit that needs to be installed in your car. if they add a tuner to an iPod, you've got almost all you mentioned. I have a FM broadcaster that lets me listen to my iPod in my car right now (albeit it doesn't sound anything close to very good.)
a new iDevice that would be REALLY nice:
1. cellphone on worldwide network
2. built-in iPod functionality (mp3s, iTunes integration)
3. full-color screen
4. can play streaming video (ie. a mini Fox News channel, etc.) - mpg4 & aac!!
5. can do chat (a la iChat & mb others)
6. built in email reader/composer
7. uses that revamped Newton technology (handwriting)
8. can be used with voice recognition
9. always on
10. address book, ical built in
11. bluetooth to sync with other iDevice users on the road?
12. usable thumb board (optional)
13. uses rendevous & isync - can even sync your iPod with it. .mac friendly :)
14. use as a universal remote control (even garage doors)
15. battery much like the iPod but with longer charge (since always on)
16. possible digital camera - but i think it would be a joke
17. audio recording
18. 20G drive - mb 40... can expand this easily
19. video conferencing capable using a QTSS
already most of this exists, it just hasn't been combined into 1 digital device yet. it would be plenty expensive, but you could combine so many devices into 1 that it would be worth it. the mac platform would keep it all synced and tidy. Something like this might cost over $800 - but whoot!
a new iDevice that would be REALLY nice:
1. cellphone on worldwide network
2. built-in iPod functionality (mp3s, iTunes integration)
3. full-color screen
4. can play streaming video (ie. a mini Fox News channel, etc.) - mpg4 & aac!!
5. can do chat (a la iChat & mb others)
6. built in email reader/composer
7. uses that revamped Newton technology (handwriting)
8. can be used with voice recognition
9. always on
10. address book, ical built in
11. bluetooth to sync with other iDevice users on the road?
12. usable thumb board (optional)
13. uses rendevous & isync - can even sync your iPod with it. .mac friendly :)
14. use as a universal remote control (even garage doors)
15. battery much like the iPod but with longer charge (since always on)
16. possible digital camera - but i think it would be a joke
17. audio recording
18. 20G drive - mb 40... can expand this easily
19. video conferencing capable using a QTSS
already most of this exists, it just hasn't been combined into 1 digital device yet. it would be plenty expensive, but you could combine so many devices into 1 that it would be worth it. the mac platform would keep it all synced and tidy. Something like this might cost over $800 - but whoot!